Forum:2017-12-15 (Friday)
Discussion for comic for . By the typing of your thumbs, something wiki this way comes. ---- Ooh, a night master! ...Whatever that is. I wonder why we never met him while Tweedle was killing off his relatives in the Refuge of Storms. ➤ It's funny how "Helping!" is such a recurring line, from kids, café customers, and now hounds. ➤ What's with Jaron's solid red eyes? Does that go with being a night master? Or is he a special construct? And why is he annoyed at the hounds helping? Are they going to slow him down? And if he didn't want them, why is he on the same ship with them? ➤ And are the two fuzzy red blobs among the hounds in panel 5 blood? ➤ And, (have I asked this before?) in what sense is vols 1-13 a "journey"? Agatha ends up in the middle of noplace, with nothing resolved: not the time freeze, not the Other in her head, not the Other out in the world, not Tweedle's modification of her body, nothing. If she were in a restored Mechanicsburg I could see that as a kind of end even with the other stuff still pending. ➤ And is this way of indicating "it's still me" okay? ➤ And most of all, what's Tarvek's plan? Bkharvey (talk) 05:24, December 15, 2017 (UTC) : Find those "Helpng" locations and make a "Helping!" theme page in the wiki. Argadi (talk) 11:32, December 15, 2017 (UTC) P.S. Check out my "Wiki" button for GG comic pages. (Now readable!) Bkharvey (talk) 07:15, December 15, 2017 (UTC) P.P.S. What are we to make of the "Foom!" sound effect in panel 2? The usual smoke-knight-style invisibility doesn't come with sound effects (e.g., ). Is Jaron displacing air as he appears because he used to be somewhere else entirely? Bkharvey (talk) 08:02, December 15, 2017 (UTC) : This certainly is a good question and one I don't think anyone has an answer for. As another example, the invisibility effect of the Heterodyne device doesn't make a specific sound (although the device it is powering might) and the Black Squad, which seems to be appearing from somewhere else entirely, also does so without a special sound effect. (The Heterodyne device and the Black Squad: two of the many, many things in this comic that seemed very significant when they first appeared, but have seemingly been completely forgotten by the Professors. Sigh.) -- William Ansley (talk) 04:18, December 16, 2017 (UTC) Hm, so are we to asume that a night master is a senior smoke knight rank or somthing else entierly. For it would be that the smoke knight kapten is on familiar terms with Jason, even if enimies in this amission. Against it: The information about the smoke knights that we have since earlier is that the smoke knights are a offshote of the storm king famely and have always had the same hair and complexion as Tarvek etc. It also adds the question of is mr obsidian a night master, note simular complexion. And any connection with the red eye on the smoke knight kaptens hat and Jasons red eyes? Agge.se (talk) 09:33, December 15, 2017 (UTC) : How do you figure that? Varpa and Malek had both brown hair and dark skin, and there are a number of other examples of Smoke Knights who aren't of the red-haired variety. Do you seriously think they color code their servants? LOL MasakoRei (talk) 18:44, December 15, 2017 (UTC) ::Dident think about Varpa and Malek, but I remember Tarvek saying somthing about the smoke knights beeing part of a minor houses of the(his) clan. But that might have been in refrence to someone specifick. Also the complexion and so on might also be a side effect of thear power, alchemy or recruting from peaple with a affinity for the power. Agge.se (talk) 19:43, December 15, 2017 (UTC) ::: Tarvek said that about Violetta. It's probable that lower ranked nobles frequently send their kids to make a career as Smoke Knights, but it would be terribly restrictive to only recruit family members for such an important job. You should stop obsessing about "complexion". We've seen a vast number of black people in this comic who had no particular ability. Mr. Obsidian and Jaron are both either constructs, or humans "improved" by a Spark, but that's also been the case of a vast number of diversely colored characters so far. This is a comic about mad science. Not a comic about black people having eldritch powers. MasakoRei (talk) 20:07, December 15, 2017 (UTC) ::::That was in no way even close to my intention and I apologize if I have insulted you. Agge.se (talk) 20:15, December 15, 2017 (UTC ::::: Now it seems you're making (wrong) assumptions about my skin color. *sigh* You're American, aren't you? No, you haven't insulted me. I just found your theory bizarre especially in the context of Girl Genius. MasakoRei (talk) 20:38, December 15, 2017 (UTC) ::::::: What, no racism in the rest of the world? Never mind, I'm often enough embarrassed to be American... And no, I'm not calling anyone here racist! But could we get back to "What's Tarvek's plan?"? Bkharvey (talk) 22:39, December 15, 2017 (UTC) :::::::Again you put your words in my mouth, I did not asume anything about you I know plenty of peaple that gets insulted on behaf of groups that they do not belong to or just becous. Anyway it was just a idea that it could be some conection between Jason and mr Obsidian. On, maybe I dident every posible interpreration of the way I wrote it but be sure that that simple idea was the only thing I tried to say. Anyway I agree with Bkharvey that this thread is not leading anyware. Conserning whare I live the part after the dot in my forum name is my contries top level domain so I have never tryed to hide that and my spelling and gramer should give you some clue that english is not my first launguge. Agge.se (talk) 23:35, December 15, 2017 (UTC) ::::::: ::::::::Ok now I am at a computer and can write something more considered then a quick reply on mobile. ::::::::Let me begin with admitting that I put my foot in my mouth with my posts and I should have thought more about how I expressed myself then I did. ::::::::Any way to get any kind of end to this let just draw a line over all of it and start over with me introducing myself to you MasakoRei because I don't think we have meet before. My name is Axel, I am from and live in Sweden, I have not been especially active on the wikia the last couple of years. In general my spelling and grammar are not the best, especially on mobile given the lack of useful spell checker. Depending on what type of edit and and so on I might spend more or less time getting it exactly correct but concentrating on getting the data on the page and someone that are better at spelling can fix that without needing to also check the data. In the day to day forums I sometimes throw in an idea without thinking too much about it. I hope that we both in our own ways can help in the work of making this wikia even better. Agge.se (talk) 01:03, December 16, 2017 (UTC) ::::::::: I expressed myself badly as well. I wanted to introduce myself as well, and explain my intentions better without derailing this page any more than I already have, so I made a post to your talk page. Thank you for stepping back from this rabbit hole discussion and starting over. MasakoRei (talk) 21:20, December 17, 2017 (UTC) ::::::::::I on the other hand throw out six ideas at once and then nobody answers most of them. :) So, about this sound effect when Jaron pops into view... Bkharvey (talk) 01:18, December 16, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::::I found where that sound effect have been used before . I was first thinking about the black squad but apparently they make a completely different sound . So maybe Jason appears in a flash of fire? Agge.se (talk) 18:15, December 16, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::::::Hmm, I never paid enough attention to that page with Gil before. We know he has a cloak of invisibility, or maybe the Heterodyne Device does it, but nowhere else (I think) is there any suggestion that he can teleport. If he could do that, he could have used the ability in lots of other situations, e.g., needing to be at Castle Wulfenbach and the Hospital at the same time. Bkharvey (talk) 22:24, December 16, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::::::: The sound effect on that page is lighting the hat. That convinces most of the people he is Gil (one person gets a punch and a promotion promise). Argadi (talk) 23:49, December 16, 2017 (UTC) :::::::::::::::: Oh, all those tiny panels are simultaneous! Thanks for explaining that. Bkharvey (talk) 05:10, December 17, 2017 (UTC) So, 'Martellus' personal assasin' and sparkhounds that are thrilled to slaughter and eat everyone... yet another example, if one were needed, of what a complete waste of space Tweedle is. He needs to be removed. Autoch (talk) : Tweedle is just like the old Heterodynes and like what we know of the leaders of the Fifty Families. If Andronicus had died in the usual way, after leaving an unchallenged heir, and that line had continued to the present, with Tweedle as designated heir, we might never have known what violence he was capable of. He doesn't love violence for its own sake like Bang or Vole; he ordered Jaron not to kill the Paris revenants. (Yes, I know, he did it because people were watching. He did kill Rerich unnecessarily. Still.) I'm not saying I'd like to be his friend, as I would Agatha or Tarvek or Gil. But I wonder if Gil would be so nice if Klaus's empire had been broken before he became known as heir apparent. Bkharvey (talk) 03:25, December 17, 2017 (UTC) How embarrassing! When I saw today's page I thought, "Finally, we have a name for this guy!" I deliberately referred to him consistently in the chronologies so I could easily use find and replace if he did get a name. But, when I went back to update the old references with links (which I have done, although they are red links, for the moment), I discovered that we have known his name since way back on I even recorded it in the entry for this page in the Chronology, but must have immediately forgotten about it. I really am getting old. Well, at least the Foglios were consistent this time. -- William Ansley (talk) 18:08, December 15, 2017 (UTC) : You think you're embarrassed! I totally never noticed him before! Bkharvey (talk) 19:36, December 15, 2017 (UTC) :: Well, I am supposedly maintaining the chronology, so I should be noticing new characters, which I did, and remembering them, which I didn't. By the way, there is a page for Jaron now. -- William Ansley (talk) 19:47, December 15, 2017 (UTC) :::: By the way, , Jaron says "we" about the smoke knights. Bkharvey (talk) 01:48, December 18, 2017 (UTC) Something we haven't discussed yet is Jaron's remark in panel 2. He suggests that Tweedle has to do away with Tarvek because the latter is so skillful. And not skillful at plotting; skillful at, I guess you'd say, knighthood. Nobody has suggested that before. I know, for the first half of the story he was deliberately pretending to be unskillful, but even after that, we had no reason to think he was more than a generic smoke knight. Of course Jaron could just be wrong about Tweedle's motivation (wrong in a plausible way because of course being a specialist he's inclined to view everything in terms of his specialty: "If all you have is a hammer..."). But I'd love to see a swashbuckling Tarvek swinging from a chandelier. Bkharvey (talk) 05:22, December 17, 2017 (UTC) P.S. Rereading what I just said... Yes, we've seen him drop down from above onto and onto , and take on the . So we know he's both brave and reasonably skillful. Just, not so very skillful as to pose a unique threat to Tweedle. The threat is that he's a rival claimant to the throne. So, is Jaron just wrong? Bkharvey (talk) 05:43, December 17, 2017 (UTC) Technical Note Well, the horizontal rule wiki code in these forums seems to have started working again for me all of a sudden. By horizontal rule, I mean a line like this: ---- Has anyone else noticed that the lines at the tops of these forum pages were missing and suddenly reappeared, or has it just been a problem with my setup? -- William Ansley (talk) 13:05, December 15, 2017 (UTC) : I'm sorry, it's not something I would notice most of the time. I read the wiki mostly through the edit view. Argadi (talk) 16:04, December 15, 2017 (UTC) :: That's OK. Please tell me if you see a horizontal rule at the top of this page now, as well one near the top of this section, "Technical Note". Let me know if you see both, neither, or only one (and, in that case, which one). I saw the top rule this moring, but now don't see it again on another PC. -- William Ansley (talk) 18:06, December 15, 2017 (UTC) :::: I haven't noticed any problems with missing rules, although, like Argadi, I might not have noticed if there had been one. Interesting side note: The section heading seems to come with a pale grey rule. ("Come with" because there's nothing in the source asking for a rule there.) Perhaps the following will console you... Bkharvey (talk) 19:36, December 15, 2017 (UTC) ::::: The only thing that never looks right is a rule. There is not in existence a page with a rule on it that cannot be instantly and obviously improved by taking the rule out. :::::— George Bernard Shaw, in The Dolphin, quoted in Donald E. Knuth, The TEXbook. ::::: I kind of agree with GBS. These pages would look better without the rule near the top. But the comprehensibility would decrease. Some indicator is needed to separate the header and the discussion, and I think the rule works better than a large white space (and it's easier to keep the rule than a consistent white space with many editors). ::::: But I see the rule at the top of this page and also near the start of this section. And the rule at the top should stay until we get a designed to come up with a new format that works better. Argadi (talk) 11:52, December 16, 2017 (UTC) ::::::: For what it's worth, I don't hate rules. (Knuth quotes Shaw in an endnote to the chapter on how to make rules in TeX.) Bkharvey (talk) 22:24, December 16, 2017 (UTC)